Hi All Anyone care to give a brief report on Phillip Island from last week...? Good numbers for early season but there appears to be some erratic results with DNF's..... Please share...
Race 1 On lap 1 as we all arrived at turn 4, Nathan turned around, I got by on the inside but the guys on the outside all got caught out. Nathan, Rick, Peter and Todd were all out. Meanwhile Craig, who was about 6 inches I front of all this, had made a gap that he maintained until the end of the race. I was a few seconds back and Steve Morling finished his first Superkart race third.
Race 2 The front 4 got away together and fought our way through some of the bigger classes as a group. A fantastic race was building when the red flags came out for an incident on the track(luckily nobody was hurt).
Race 3 Started like race 2, but this time I turned around at turn 4. At the same time Steve went strait on as well. The front 3 had a great race, which was won by Craig, from Rick then Nathan. I kept going and got back to forth. Peter was unable to start due to race 1 damage.
Race 4 There was only 10 minutes between races 3 and 4, and all classes did a great job to be ready in time. From the green flag it was on, with the 4 front runners in Stock Honda locked together. Positions changed constantly, with all of us having a go at the front on most laps. Late in the race Craig slowed through turn 5, and pulled off. I got borked as he slowed and had to settle for third. Rick got the win from Nathan.
The racing was awesome all day, with plenty of slipstreaming and 2 and 3 wide racing.
Nearly 4 wide. I think this wing formation might frustrate a few of the inter drivers at some stage! This was the last lap of the last race heading into turn 3
Do we want to organise a meet later in the year at PI..? I would bring a few with me. [/quote]
It would be great if we can make that happen. The best options for me would be the May or August race meetings. June I will hopefully be out of town. Remember the AASA Nationals are at Winton in November, so earlier may be better for some. Also a possibility to run Stock Honda at Sandown in April (TBC), can't wait for that!
[quote author=PIL007 link=topic=2295.msg25280#msg25280 date=1392155239] Nath......any video you want to share..? [/quote]
Unfortunately Pil, the GoPro has revealed alot of mistakes and bad lines so to save face I will leave the videos for now! If I can string together a couple of good laps at a later date I will be more than happy to add them to my public drop box folder for all within this forum to view...
[quote author=PIL007 link=topic=2295.msg25280#msg25280 date=1392155239] Do we want to organise a meet later in the year at PI..? I would bring a few with me. [/quote]
That would be awesome mate! Hope it can happen! Bascially as it is now with last years front runners either moving on or pulling back a little there is a Woodgate battle pack 5 stong here locked together with the 2 new guys soon to catch. So to have a pack of potentially 9 guys all locked together in the draft, well, what can I say, f#$ken bring it on!!!
We did touch on after the drivers briefing of creating a gap on the roll around to the opens. (Similar to the what the Rotax guys do with us GB guys), I think if we had a good turn out (say 10+ Hondas) then that could be a potential discussion with the Stock Honda person who qualified pole to see if it's a good idea?
[quote author=hjtrbo link=topic=2295.msg25282#msg25282 date=1392187479] Unfortunately Pil, the GoPro has revealed alot of mistakes and bad lines so to save face I will leave the videos for now! If I can string together a couple of good laps at a later date I will be more than happy to add them to my public drop box folder for all within this forum to view... [/quote] Don't need video Nathan, the picture above shows mistakes too. You should be positioned in the slipstream of #97, then you can get a move onto a double slipstream with #28 and whammo before you reach Turn 4 Honda, you will be in front with a very fast lap time recorded to Natsoft. Instead you guys are all trying to drag race each other with equal horsepower.....that never going to work in a controlled class, you need to team up with the opposition with a track like Phillip Island.
Just like my sex instruction classes, the first lesson you just received is free. ;)
The next lesson is know how to plan that move so that you are in front when it really matters.........at the finish line.
Sam, they kept that formation even down the straight. At one stage five of them were four abreast across the finish line and the fifth kart decided to pop out and close the last gap left right in front of a 250. He doesn't know how lucky he was, I think everyone on the pit lane wall closed their eyes expecting him to be launched. It was only the good driving by the 250 driver that managed to miss him, and it wasn't the last lap.
There's been a lot of discussion amongst some of the Stock Honda guys about the weekend, and most would agree that things need to change into the future or somebody is going to come unstuck.
It's a pity Greame is more interested in canning the Stock Honda guys than sticking to facts though. At no stage were 5 Stock Hondas together on the straight, and the only time the twins passed us was on the last lap, each time between Hayshed and the straight and we were never in a group of 4 when that happened. With that in mind I'm assuming you are talking about the red flagged race. In that race the lead Stondas passed 2 of the 3 125's and 3 of the 4 singles up the back of the circuit. In that case are you saying the smaller class should pull over and let the big boys back past, or is it how I was told and the slow guys in the big class if caught, should yeild and follow, and only repass if they can do so cleanly and without interfering with the smaller class race. If the latter is the case, then the 125s and 250s should have held station until things settled then the freakishly talented 250 driver could have passed in a safe manner, as Jarrod did with Craig and myself early in the day.
What we are all agreed on is there needs to be more respect for the speed and other competitors, and in that regard there is fault on both sides of the equation. There also needs to be more effort made to ensure new drivers(and some not so new) know how to interact with other classes, and the Stock Honda class needs to leave more room at the start so we don't run over the slower guys in the bigger classes on the first lap.
Jeff are you thinking about touching some velvet again ;D
Righto, video of last race is been uploaded as I write. Should be available for view tomorrow. Then we can all see what went on, well what didn't actually go on if you know what i'm saying...
Well worth some discussion......The right place is at the race meeting in briefing or in this case after that race by who ever is in charge if indeed it was dangerous. We all need to go home to our jobs at the end of the day. Jeff i'll call for a chat.....Nath, post the vid as it may help clear this up.
[quote author=PIL007 link=topic=2295.msg25306#msg25306 date=1392324910] Nath, post the vid as it may help clear this up. [/quote]
Sorry, I have tried 3 times now, i'm out in the sticks, the internet is shocking out here. Will try again over the weekend.
What I can say is what Jeff said about the inters coming past is correct. Perhaps Graeme is talking about another class as none of the videos I have show what he is talking about... That said, I agree with all that we need to be very careful out there when the inters come through on laps 4 and 5. I welcome any discussion around safety strategies at the drivers briefing.
Jeff and Nathan I have nothing against the Stock Honda class and during my time on the NSA pushed for its inclusion as a class, so please let go of this all you do is knock the Stock Honda class. No where in my post did I say that the kart passing was a 250 Twin, it was in fact a 250 National and it happened at the finish line. I wasn't the only one that saw the incident and it was commented on by a few people. If I was doing the job that I do at the Superkart Championship meetings, I would have had you all up before the stewards for a good dressing down. If you can't take constructive criticism and learn from it then you are in the wrong sport.
I think you have your lines crossed Greame, and thank god your not the judge of fact. As I said, at no stage during the day did 5 Stock Hondas cross the line together at any stage of any race. That is a fact whether it suits you to belive it or not. Secondly, how did the 250 end up behind the Stock Hondas? None of them were anywhere near quick enough to be lapping us! The answer is we passed them. Two of them were P platers, and the other was just slow. As for the 4 wide racing, even if the club doesn't do anything, we will get together as a group and put together some rules of engagement to avoid a repeat situation. We also need the guys in 125 and 250 nat' to appreciate there is another class behind them now, and if they aren't on the pace and get passed, they need to give the smaller karts due respect. That is something that definately hasn't been happening in recent race meetings. As for constructive critisism, coming on a forum and presenting sensationalist bullshit as facts isn't constructive, but it does definately spark a response.
Jeff from where I was standing on the pit it was very lucky that a certain stock honda didn't go across the start finish line on his head. Regardless of the situation for someone to swing right 5 to six metres and nearly collect the 250 was foolish. Maybe it was lucky he was a 'slow' 250 because a twin wouldn't have been able to pull up. And yes the 250 would have made it five wide! As Sammy said, maybe some people need to learn to slipstream not drag race.
I hear you Scott. What you say is pretty close to how I figured it must have been when I filtered the previous version. As I said, we will get together as a group and sort the issues such as swerving.
The fifth Stonda must have been behind a grassy knoll or something then?
Duck which ever way you look at it, even in the footage posted, at many stages the Stock Honda's covered the whole track and racing as if they are the only drivers on the track. Rolf has commented, Scott has commented and I have commented so for F**k sake take it that the driving of the Stock Honda people at the PI meeting was terrible. And for your information the Judge of Fact determines if anyone has jumped the start and the Finishing order, that is not the job I do for the Australian Championship, I advise the CofC on driving standards and other problems for Superkarts. And a grassy knoll would have been the safest place for any Stock Honda at PI, the first 250Inter to pass is shown passing one on the left and then the next one on the right. You would all drop your lap times by taking the shortest route around the circuit, at the moment most of you are covering more ground than Blaxland, Lawson and Wentworth.
The problem here is always the same....we have to co exist with other faster and slower classes and the answer is figuring out the best way to do this and move forward safely without cruelling our own race. Love to hear some suggestions on this from all sides and I will be bringing it up at our meeting also. Lets all play nice.
In my last 2 posts Ive commented that we would get together as a group and discuss the 4 wide and swerving. I think that pretty much accounts for taking it on board.
The gratest shame out of all this is that there was plenty of sub standard driving at PI, by 125 and 250 singles as well, but nobody came near any of us on the day, and absolutely nothing was said at the club meeting a few days later, instead people take to social media to attack 1 class. Theres plenty of new people taking to the track, and they require coaching and advise, not to be descibed as a discrace and torn apart publicly. If this is how things are sorted, I can see why people leave the sport so readily!
Please Greame, if you see something like that again, come up to the garage and tell us what we are doing wrong, then it can be fixed on the spot in a truly productive way.
Its all very well to say this should be discussed at the track but when you are involved with other things it doesn't give you time. We were running three karts at the meeting and when you have problems with two of them you are kept busy. When there is only a small amount of time between heats it doesn't give much time for discussion even after the last heat with packing up of the three karts. I was going to bring it up at the Club meeting but was not able to attend due to illness.
I understand there were time constraints on the day but if this was as dangerous as said here the tower should have been involved and it not wait a second longer.....anyhoo lets all get on to it and learn. We will talk Jeff and Nath soon.
Righto, a little late and probably not of interest since we are all now looking forward to the ASE / VSKC round at Winton.
So, for your viewing pleasure Race 4, Stock Honda at Phillip Island: http://youtu.be/ZG-EsbC6w5s
Please read before watching: This video is unlisted for a reason. Please do not embed, share or copy this content. I encourage any constructive comments and / or race craft direction to enable me to get into the 1:50's!!! :) I might even pay some cash / beer to the person with the best tips lol!
I can see what Graeme and Rolf are saying, so long as you guys take it on board you will be right. If you keep racing like that where you are weaving four wide up the straight someone will get hurt. In saying that there was some pretty slow higher powered karts out there that seem to like blasting past in a straight line and jumping on the brakes way to early. You guys look to be having heaps of fun though, just work on the awareness and you will all go to work on Monday ;)
That is some great racing in great conditions....... At the 8min mark you guys did take up a fair bit of track which is fine when on the track alone but late in a race with those 250 coming we need to keep it tighter to one side of the track........as Jas said, just take it on board. This forum is great for this stuff but we need to mind full of our delivery. Nice work Nath thanks......
[quote author=hjtrbo link=topic=2295.msg25373#msg25373 date=1392785727] Righto, a little late and probably not of interest since we are all now looking forward to the ASE / VSKC round at Winton.
So, for your viewing pleasure Race 4, Stock Honda at Phillip Island: http://youtu.be/ZG-EsbC6w5s
Please read before watching: This video is unlisted for a reason. Please do not embed, share or copy this content. I encourage any constructive comments and / or race craft direction to enable me to get into the 1:50's!!! :) I might even pay some cash / beer to the person with the best tips lol! [/quote]
Buy a Nose cone ya tight arse! I drink Coopers thanks! 8) ;D
Just finished fitting one bro! Stockman 125 style. She's a bit bare at the minute, but will look into some cool graphics shortly...
BTW, I have marked that video I posted earlier as private. If anyone wants to see it, flick me your gmail address (or create one), PM me and i'll add you. I left it open for a week, to minmise the risk of it getting out in the open domain private she now is!
Comments37
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Race 1
On lap 1 as we all arrived at turn 4, Nathan turned around, I got by on the inside but the guys on the outside all got caught out. Nathan, Rick, Peter and Todd were all out.
Meanwhile Craig, who was about 6 inches I front of all this, had made a gap that he maintained until the end of the race. I was a few seconds back and Steve Morling finished his first Superkart race third.
Race 2
The front 4 got away together and fought our way through some of the bigger classes as a group. A fantastic race was building when the red flags came out for an incident on the track(luckily nobody was hurt).
Race 3
Started like race 2, but this time I turned around at turn 4. At the same time Steve went strait on as well.
The front 3 had a great race, which was won by Craig, from Rick then Nathan. I kept going and got back to forth. Peter was unable to start due to race 1 damage.
Race 4
There was only 10 minutes between races 3 and 4, and all classes did a great job to be ready in time.
From the green flag it was on, with the 4 front runners in Stock Honda locked together. Positions changed constantly, with all of us having a go at the front on most laps. Late in the race Craig slowed through turn 5, and pulled off. I got borked as he slowed and had to settle for third. Rick got the win from Nathan.
The racing was awesome all day, with plenty of slipstreaming and 2 and 3 wide racing.
Exactly what we were promised with Stock Honda.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
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Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
That is an awesome pic Nath......any video you want to share..?
Do we want to organise a meet later in the year at PI..? I would bring a few with me.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Do we want to organise a meet later in the year at PI..? I would bring a few with me.
[/quote]
It would be great if we can make that happen.
The best options for me would be the May or August race meetings. June I will hopefully be out of town.
Remember the AASA Nationals are at Winton in November, so earlier may be better for some.
Also a possibility to run Stock Honda at Sandown in April (TBC), can't wait for that!
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Nath......any video you want to share..?
[/quote]
Unfortunately Pil, the GoPro has revealed alot of mistakes and bad lines so to save face I will leave the videos for now! If I can string together a couple of good laps at a later date I will be more than happy to add them to my public drop box folder for all within this forum to view...
[quote author=PIL007 link=topic=2295.msg25280#msg25280 date=1392155239]
Do we want to organise a meet later in the year at PI..? I would bring a few with me.
[/quote]
That would be awesome mate! Hope it can happen! Bascially as it is now with last years front runners either moving on or pulling back a little there is a Woodgate battle pack 5 stong here locked together with the 2 new guys soon to catch. So to have a pack of potentially 9 guys all locked together in the draft, well, what can I say, f#$ken bring it on!!!
We did touch on after the drivers briefing of creating a gap on the roll around to the opens. (Similar to the what the Rotax guys do with us GB guys), I think if we had a good turn out (say 10+ Hondas) then that could be a potential discussion with the Stock Honda person who qualified pole to see if it's a good idea?
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Unfortunately Pil, the GoPro has revealed alot of mistakes and bad lines so to save face I will leave the videos for now! If I can string together a couple of good laps at a later date I will be more than happy to add them to my public drop box folder for all within this forum to view...
[/quote]
Don't need video Nathan, the picture above shows mistakes too.
You should be positioned in the slipstream of #97, then you can get a move onto a double slipstream with #28 and whammo before you reach Turn 4 Honda, you will be in front with a very fast lap time recorded to Natsoft.
Instead you guys are all trying to drag race each other with equal horsepower.....that never going to work in a controlled class, you need to team up with the opposition with a track like Phillip Island.
Just like my sex instruction classes, the first lesson you just received is free. ;)
The next lesson is know how to plan that move so that you are in front when it really matters.........at the finish line.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
OH MY F#CKING LORD ......Sam is giving sex lessons.......I'm getting visions of a monkey on a jackhammer screaming shut up and listen.
Could we keep this stuff to the "Ask Sam" thread.
Nath......send the video, warts and all.....we can then critique it......
Lets discuss the PI date some more. I'll check on this end.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
It might only be a matter of time.
Time to take care guys.
And Pil?
Is this Sam afterwards?
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
It's a pity Greame is more interested in canning the Stock Honda guys than sticking to facts though.
At no stage were 5 Stock Hondas together on the straight, and the only time the twins passed us was on the last lap, each time between Hayshed and the straight and we were never in a group of 4 when that happened.
With that in mind I'm assuming you are talking about the red flagged race. In that race the lead Stondas passed 2 of the 3 125's and 3 of the 4 singles up the back of the circuit.
In that case are you saying the smaller class should pull over and let the big boys back past, or is it how I was told and the slow guys in the big class if caught, should yeild and follow, and only repass if they can do so cleanly and without interfering with the smaller class race.
If the latter is the case, then the 125s and 250s should have held station until things settled then the freakishly talented 250 driver could have passed in a safe manner, as Jarrod did with Craig and myself early in the day.
What we are all agreed on is there needs to be more respect for the speed and other competitors, and in that regard there is fault on both sides of the equation.
There also needs to be more effort made to ensure new drivers(and some not so new) know how to interact with other classes, and the Stock Honda class needs to leave more room at the start so we don't run over the slower guys in the bigger classes on the first lap.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Righto, video of last race is been uploaded as I write. Should be available for view tomorrow. Then we can all see what went on, well what didn't actually go on if you know what i'm saying...
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Jeff i'll call for a chat.....Nath, post the vid as it may help clear this up.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Nath, post the vid as it may help clear this up.
[/quote]
Sorry, I have tried 3 times now, i'm out in the sticks, the internet is shocking out here. Will try again over the weekend.
What I can say is what Jeff said about the inters coming past is correct. Perhaps Graeme is talking about another class as none of the videos I have show what he is talking about... That said, I agree with all that we need to be very careful out there when the inters come through on laps 4 and 5. I welcome any discussion around safety strategies at the drivers briefing.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
As I said, at no stage during the day did 5 Stock Hondas cross the line together at any stage of any race. That is a fact whether it suits you to belive it or not.
Secondly, how did the 250 end up behind the Stock Hondas? None of them were anywhere near quick enough to be lapping us! The answer is we passed them. Two of them were P platers, and the other was just slow.
As for the 4 wide racing, even if the club doesn't do anything, we will get together as a group and put together some rules of engagement to avoid a repeat situation.
We also need the guys in 125 and 250 nat' to appreciate there is another class behind them now, and if they aren't on the pace and get passed, they need to give the smaller karts due respect. That is something that definately hasn't been happening in recent race meetings.
As for constructive critisism, coming on a forum and presenting sensationalist bullshit as facts isn't constructive, but it does definately spark a response.
All out of velvet today Bro!
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
As I said, we will get together as a group and sort the issues such as swerving.
The fifth Stonda must have been behind a grassy knoll or something then?
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Constructive criticism welcome, race craft lessons also welcome. This is only my 2nd year of any form of motorsport so go easy on me please!
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87339048/140211_Phillip%20Island_Race%204/R4.wmv
Edited 8:46pm
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Umm.dropbox is not so good,.. Sorry can't see it
[/quote]
You on an Apple? It's a wmv file...
[quote author=Nat22 link=topic=2295.msg25326#msg25326 date=1392545009]
Stock Honda's covered the whole track
[/quote]
I'm gonna learn how to push. Saves going three wide or dragging the brakes.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
This account's public links are generating too much traffic and have been temporarily disabled!
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Love to hear some suggestions on this from all sides and I will be bringing it up at our meeting also.
Lets all play nice.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
I am getting the same error as Rolf – would love to see the video, any chance of You Tube?
BTW – what top speed/RPM are you guys getting at PI from the Stock Honda?
Regards
Allan.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
In my last 2 posts Ive commented that we would get together as a group and discuss the 4 wide and swerving. I think that pretty much accounts for taking it on board.
The gratest shame out of all this is that there was plenty of sub standard driving at PI, by 125 and 250 singles as well, but nobody came near any of us on the day, and absolutely nothing was said at the club meeting a few days later, instead people take to social media to attack 1 class. Theres plenty of new people taking to the track, and they require coaching and advise, not to be descibed as a discrace and torn apart publicly.
If this is how things are sorted, I can see why people leave the sport so readily!
Please Greame, if you see something like that again, come up to the garage and tell us what we are doing wrong, then it can be fixed on the spot in a truly productive way.
As Nathan has said, we're all pretty new to this.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
We will talk Jeff and Nath soon.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
C.O.W :D
[/quote]
Can of Worms? lol
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
So, for your viewing pleasure Race 4, Stock Honda at Phillip Island: http://youtu.be/ZG-EsbC6w5s
Please read before watching: This video is unlisted for a reason. Please do not embed, share or copy this content. I encourage any constructive comments and / or race craft direction to enable me to get into the 1:50's!!! :) I might even pay some cash / beer to the person with the best tips lol!
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
I can see what Graeme and Rolf are saying, so long as you guys take it on board you will be right. If you keep racing like that where you are weaving four wide up the straight someone will get hurt. In saying that there was some pretty slow higher powered karts out there that seem to like blasting past in a straight line and jumping on the brakes way to early.
You guys look to be having heaps of fun though, just work on the awareness and you will all go to work on Monday ;)
Jason.
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
At the 8min mark you guys did take up a fair bit of track which is fine when on the track alone but late in a race with those 250 coming we need to keep it tighter to one side of the track........as Jas said, just take it on board.
This forum is great for this stuff but we need to mind full of our delivery.
Nice work Nath thanks......
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
we need to keep it tighter to one side of the track
[/quote]
I think that's the nail been hit on the head...
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
Righto, a little late and probably not of interest since we are all now looking forward to the ASE / VSKC round at Winton.
So, for your viewing pleasure Race 4, Stock Honda at Phillip Island: http://youtu.be/ZG-EsbC6w5s
Please read before watching: This video is unlisted for a reason. Please do not embed, share or copy this content. I encourage any constructive comments and / or race craft direction to enable me to get into the 1:50's!!! :) I might even pay some cash / beer to the person with the best tips lol!
[/quote]
Buy a Nose cone ya tight arse! I drink Coopers thanks! 8) ;D
Re: Stock Honda Race Reports
BTW, I have marked that video I posted earlier as private. If anyone wants to see it, flick me your gmail address (or create one), PM me and i'll add you. I left it open for a week, to minmise the risk of it getting out in the open domain private she now is!